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Now we've qualified for the tournament in Russia, have we got the team, as well as the government, we deserve? Southgate looks more hapless with each game and, though we won most of our matches, it was hardly with any style or conviction to put it mildly. Normally we look like world beaters in qualifying before crashing and burning when the tournament proper begins. So it will be interesting to see how things pan out when we've been utter shite in qualifying as well. All part of a cunning plan perhaps ?

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1 minute ago, RNaj1 said:

Now we've qualified for the tournament in Russia, have we got the team, as well as the government, we deserve? Southgate looks more hapless with each game and, though we won most of our matches, it was hardly with any style or conviction to put it mildly. Normally we look like world beaters in qualifying before crashing and burning when the tournament proper begins. So it will be interesting to see how things pan out when we've been utter shite in qualifying as well. All part of a cunning plan perhaps ?

Last night's game was one of the most boring England games of all time...and that takes some doing. I doubt we'll even get through our qualifying Group in Russia - there are actually some England players in the squad that i've not really heard of before! And to think i used to follow them all over Europe...

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Englands qualification seems to have been met by a minor "meh" by everyone. Why is there a disconnect between the team and country? Playing at Wembley all the time? Fleecing families with new (and rubbish) kits all the time? 
Scotland, on the other hand, take us through hell and we still follow them blindly, even if it's from behind the sofa. Hey, we'll even wear pink proudly. And there's still only a remote chance of qualification....as usual.
But one thing Ingurland could do well would be to ditch their ruddy "band"!
Or is it too many times England Expects But fails To Deliver? 

Anyone??

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30 minutes ago, Kacc said:

Englands qualification seems to have been met by a minor "meh" by everyone. Why is there a disconnect between the team and country? Playing at Wembley all the time? Fleecing families with new (and rubbish) kits all the time? 
Scotland, on the other hand, take us through hell and we still follow them blindly, even if it's from behind the sofa. Hey, we'll even wear pink proudly. And there's still only a remote chance of qualification....as usual.
But one thing Ingurland could do well would be to ditch their ruddy "band"!
Or is it too many times England Expects But fails To Deliver? 

Anyone??

England coz they're a bunch of overpaid garbage.

Scotland coz i actually want them to lose! Come on Slovenia!!!

Looking forward to Wales v Ireland tomorrow though - now that will be proper football. 

I see your lot (Holland) are struggling again. What do you need to do on Tuesday to get 2nd place, goal difference is confusing, coz dont they discount the bottom place team's results? 

Edited by R11 BFC

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21 minutes ago, R11 BFC said:

England coz they're a bunch of overpaid garbage.

Scotland coz i actually want them to lose! Come on Slovenia!!!

Looking forward to Wales v Ireland tomorrow though - now that will be proper football. 

I see your lot (Holland) are struggling again. What do you need to do on Tuesday to get 2nd place, goal difference is confusing, coz dont they discount the bottom place team's results? 

Yes, the current feeling is they need 7 - 0 (8 - 1) etc. However before the last round I double-checked the EUFA/FIFA sites and it appears the results v the lowest team don't count, so Sweden's 8 v Lux could be immaterial if Lux finish bottom. But it's possible - but unlikely - for Lux to not finish bottom and I haven't worked that out.
But not one piece has given the actual correct advice on what we need to do, even the Dutch papers. 
Anyways, Holland deserve to be nowhere near the finals, weak team and even weaker squad and frankly if qualification is so improbable/impossible I'll support Sweden to get France into the playoffs and make them suffer!! I bet I'm not the only Oranjefan than might be wearing yellow on Tuesday!
Volkskrant; 

Quote

Het is nog niet officieel, maar het Nederlands elftal gaat het WK voetbal in Rusland missen. Oranje won zaterdag in Borisov met 3-1 van Wit-Rusland, maar die uitslag stak schril af tegen de 8-0 van Zweden tegen Luxemburg, een paar uur eerder.

So they say Oranje aren't officially out yet.

Edited by Kacc

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14 minutes ago, Kacc said:

Yes, the current feeling is they need 7 - 0 (8 - 1) etc. However before the last round I double-checked the EUFA/FIFA sites and it appears the results v the lowest team don't count, so Sweden's 8 v Lux could be immaterial if Lux finish bottom. But it's possible - but unlikely - for Lux to not finish bottom and I haven't worked that out.
But not one piece has given the actual correct advice on what we need to do, even the Dutch papers. 
Anyways, Holland deserve to be nowhere near the finals, weak team and even weaker squad and frankly if qualification is so improbable/impossible I'll support Sweden to get France into the playoffs and make them suffer!! I bet I'm not the only Oranjefan than might be wearing yellow on Tuesday!
Volkskrant; 

So they say Oranje aren't officially out yet.

As clear as mud then, for the William of Orange supporters. ;)

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The lack of enthusiasm, optimism and expectation may well be the greatest asset an England squad has had in any recent tournament.

I watched the documentary One Night in Turin, and we went to Italy after an underwhelming qualifying group, with the management at war with the media and the only expectation being that may well get expelled. Indeed many in the government did not want us to go and supported the brutal tactics of the Italian police. It took a performance against the Dutch to galvanize the team, who rode their luck till the semi final powered by the goals of Lineker and the genius of Gascoigne. Went as no marks and came back as heroes. 

I reckon the lack of distractions in Russia with the zero expectation of success will remove the burden of pressure off this young team. If we can generate momentum we should do well. The best team / players do not always achieve, just look at Portugal in the Euro.

 

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Harry Maguire playing for England today - never even heard of him! Also during the national anthem, i only recognised about half of them!

Granted it's probably more to do with my lack of Premier League knowledge but deary me. 

If England actually played in the Premier League...i wonder what position they'd end up? I'm going for 10th!

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6 hours ago, R11 BFC said:

England coz they're a bunch of overpaid garbage.

Scotland coz i actually want them to lose! Come on Slovenia!!!

Looking forward to Wales v Ireland tomorrow though - now that will be proper football. 

I see your lot (Holland) are struggling again. What do you need to do on Tuesday to get 2nd place, goal difference is confusing, coz dont they discount the bottom place team's results? 

xD

 

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Plenty of nightmares from previous tournaments likely to be there as well. Morocco just need to avoid defeat in the last game against Ivory Coast to qualify at their expense. Poland through tonight. Iceland top their group. Fortunately no Norway or Algeria but plenty of scope for this group to make complete prats of themselves I'd have thought.

Edited by RNaj1
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As a kid watching England under Venables and Hoddle, arguably, under Sven as well, (okay only initially) used to be a genuine treat, whether that be a friendly, a qualifier or watching us play in international tournaments. My dad used to video highlights of games for us and sit and watch it with us because we all loved watching England play, that included such tournaments as the 'umbro cup' or whatever it was called, a friendly tournament that was probably little more than a few games for charity. I even remember rushing home from school once to watch the recording of the highlights of our friendly game vs Japan at Wembley. Another thing was that any international game in the summer months provided an excellent stop gap for those missing the football season. Now though I couldn't give a stuff, qualifiers are a formality where you know we will either flatter to deceive or labour to boring 1-0 or 2-1 wins. Some of these home ties and friendlies at Wembley I almost find myself feeling sorry for Tyldesley and co before turning over after enduring five minutes of that turgid, lifeless rubbish, trying to drum up enthusiasm must be hard. xD

Ill probbaly watch us in the major tournaments as it is a good excuse to go to the pub. But I know it will end in the same old bottlejob. Even the so called golden generation were an embarrasment overall when playing for the country. On paper the alot of players from the Venables Euros team were not a patch on Lampard, Gerrard, Rooney, Terry, Sturridge etc, but do you think they'd have allowed a result like that total farce against Iceland to happen? Not in a million years.

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1 hour ago, Barry P said:

As a kid watching England under Venables and Hoddle, arguably, under Sven as well, (okay only initially) used to be a genuine treat, whether that be a friendly, a qualifier or watching us play in international tournaments. My dad used to video highlights of games for us and sit and watch it with us because we all loved watching England play, that included such tournaments as the 'umbro cup' or whatever it was called, a friendly tournament that was probably little more than a few games for charity. I even remember rushing home from school once to watch the recording of the highlights of our friendly game vs Japan at Wembley. Another thing was that any international game in the summer months provided an excellent stop gap for those missing the football season. Now though I couldn't give a stuff, qualifiers are a formality where you know we will either flatter to deceive or labour to boring 1-0 or 2-1 wins. Some of these home ties and friendlies at Wembley I almost find myself feeling sorry for Tyldesley and co before turning over after enduring five minutes of that turgid, lifeless rubbish, trying to drum up enthusiasm must be hard. xD

Ill probbaly watch us in the major tournaments as it is a good excuse to go to the pub. But I know it will end in the same old bottlejob. Even the so called golden generation were an embarrasment overall when playing for the country. On paper the alot of players from the Venables Euros team were not a patch on Lampard, Gerrard, Rooney, Terry, Sturridge etc, but do you think they'd have allowed a result like that total farce against Iceland to happen? Not in a million years.

Southgate is more negative than Clark.....

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1 hour ago, Barry P said:

As a kid watching England under Venables and Hoddle, arguably, under Sven as well, (okay only initially) used to be a genuine treat, whether that be a friendly, a qualifier or watching us play in international tournaments. My dad used to video highlights of games for us and sit and watch it with us because we all loved watching England play, that included such tournaments as the 'umbro cup' or whatever it was called, a friendly tournament that was probably little more than a few games for charity. I even remember rushing home from school once to watch the recording of the highlights of our friendly game vs Japan at Wembley. Another thing was that any international game in the summer months provided an excellent stop gap for those missing the football season. Now though I couldn't give a stuff, qualifiers are a formality where you know we will either flatter to deceive or labour to boring 1-0 or 2-1 wins. Some of these home ties and friendlies at Wembley I almost find myself feeling sorry for Tyldesley and co before turning over after enduring five minutes of that turgid, lifeless rubbish, trying to drum up enthusiasm must be hard. xD

Ill probbaly watch us in the major tournaments as it is a good excuse to go to the pub. But I know it will end in the same old bottlejob. Even the so called golden generation were an embarrasment overall when playing for the country. On paper the alot of players from the Venables Euros team were not a patch on Lampard, Gerrard, Rooney, Terry, Sturridge etc, but do you think they'd have allowed a result like that total farce against Iceland to happen? Not in a million years.

Are you sure that wasnt a recording of a World War 2 battle?! ;)

Great post/rant though. :)

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52 minutes ago, scales of justice said:

Southgate is more negative than Clark.....

Takes some doing, at least he gets results though.......;)

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37 minutes ago, R11 BFC said:

Are you sure that wasnt a recording of a World War 2 battle?! ;)

Great post/rant though. :)

Had my toy soldiers for that.

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England are better as a counter-attacking side. When the onus is on them to play front-foot football against lesser opposition, they can't do it. Mostly due to the inability to move the ball accurately at tempo and also a lack of fluidity in positions and willingness to commit players forward.

Southgate's (limited) gameplan will be to play on the break using the pace of Rashford and Sterling etc and hoping Kane's conversion rate continues from the few chances we will create for him. The lack of central midfielders who can either protect the defence or play incisive forward passes is the biggest problem. The defence isn't great (Cahill has got plenty of medals at club level but struggles against top class opposition and Stones is still developing) but they don't receive protection from midfield. Henderson is particularly dire imo and tends to just get in the way.

If you don't trust your centre halves or centre mids then play three of each.... which is why I would probably go 3-5-2 /5-3-2 but I imagine Southgate will go for something the revolves around Kane up top on his own with two quick wide men off him and try to play on the break.

England's Under 20s are World Champions which is a very commendable achievement and whilst not a measure of future success should  still be reason to be optimistic. But how many of them will be playing even semi-regularly in the Premier League in the next couple of years? I'd wager not very many.

 

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5 hours ago, Barry P said:

As a kid watching England under Venables and Hoddle, arguably, under Sven as well, (okay only initially) used to be a genuine treat, whether that be a friendly, a qualifier or watching us play in international tournaments. My dad used to video highlights of games for us and sit and watch it with us because we all loved watching England play, that included such tournaments as the 'umbro cup' or whatever it was called, a friendly tournament that was probably little more than a few games for charity. I even remember rushing home from school once to watch the recording of the highlights of our friendly game vs Japan at Wembley. Another thing was that any international game in the summer months provided an excellent stop gap for those missing the football season. Now though I couldn't give a stuff, qualifiers are a formality where you know we will either flatter to deceive or labour to boring 1-0 or 2-1 wins. Some of these home ties and friendlies at Wembley I almost find myself feeling sorry for Tyldesley and co before turning over after enduring five minutes of that turgid, lifeless rubbish, trying to drum up enthusiasm must be hard. xD

Ill probbaly watch us in the major tournaments as it is a good excuse to go to the pub. But I know it will end in the same old bottlejob. Even the so called golden generation were an embarrasment overall when playing for the country. On paper the alot of players from the Venables Euros team were not a patch on Lampard, Gerrard, Rooney, Terry, Sturridge etc, but do you think they'd have allowed a result like that total farce against Iceland to happen? Not in a million years.

I remember watching that in the pub... with my Japan shirt on. :gunsmilie:

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Just now, Spee said:

I remember watching that in the pub... with my Japan shirt on. :gunsmilie:

Anderton scored with a deflection, Japan equalised, no idea who grabbed the winner for us. 

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9 minutes ago, Barry P said:

Anderton scored with a deflection, Japan equalised, no idea who grabbed the winner for us. 

Ah, I was thinking of the 2004 friendly, not the 1995 one! They've only ever met three times before.

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